Bill Bryant on sun 3 oct 04
In John Britt's book he mentions substituting tricalcium phosphate for =
bone ash. Does anyone have any experience with this? =20
Thanks,
Bill Bryant....still doing battle with the wascally wabbits....and =
losing!
Louis Katz on mon 4 oct 04
OK so its about 1979, Ken Ferguson is upset because Tomato Red (an iron
red) has stopped working. First get some old feldspar and retest...
nothing. Second different iron...nothing. Different Bone ash...nothing.
Andy Martin makes some bone ash, lots of work ... still nothing. I
believe it ended up being dolomite. I would try the synthetic.
Louis
>
>
>
Louis Katz
http://www.tamucc.edu/~lkatz
sdr on mon 4 oct 04
Bill said:
In John Britt's book he mentions substituting tricalcium phosphate for bone
ash. Does anyone have any experience with this? .....
EVERYone, nearly, has experience with this. In general,
if you order Bone Ash from your supplier, they send you
tricalcium phosphate. I use both interchangeably, no
problems thus far.
regards
Dannon Rhudy
John Hesselberth on mon 4 oct 04
Hi Bill,
Unless you are making your own bone ash, what you are buying as bone
ash is probably tricalcium phosphate. I'm not aware that there is much
of the 'real' stuff out there these days.
Regards,
John
On Sunday, October 3, 2004, at 12:47 PM, Bill Bryant wrote:
> In John Britt's book he mentions substituting tricalcium phosphate for
> bone ash. Does anyone have any experience with this?
John Hesselberth
http://www.frogpondpottery.com
http://www.masteringglazes.com
Louis Katz on mon 4 oct 04
I believe that real bone ash is no longer imported into the U.S.
because of mad cow disease but this is only a rumor.
You can make your own but its smelly and time consuming.
Louis
On Oct 4, 2004, at 8:55 AM, sdr wrote:
> Bill said:
> In John Britt's book he mentions substituting tricalcium phosphate for
> bone
> ash. Does anyone have any experience with this? .....
>
> EVERYone, nearly, has experience with this. In general,
> if you order Bone Ash from your supplier, they send you
> tricalcium phosphate. I use both interchangeably, no
> problems thus far.
>
> regards
>
> Dannon Rhudy
>
> _______________________________________________________________________
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Louis Katz
WIKI site http://www.tamucc.edu/wiki/Katz/HomePage
mailtoandrew@FSMAIL.NET on mon 4 oct 04
Hello all,
Whilst I dont claim to know about the supply in all countries but bone ash
in many countries is still calcined animal bone; and this is supplied to
industry and craft suppliers.
As always ask the supplier for data sheets of the materials you buy.
Regards,
Andrew
Cynthia Bracker on tue 5 oct 04
I ALWAYS ask customers to specify which bone ash: DiCalcium Phosphate
(Natural Bone Ash) or TriCalcium Phosphate (Synthetic Bone Ash). Many
customers have told us that they do not always work interchangeably.
They will work similarly and if it's a new recipe, you can basically
pick one and try it, or preferably, test both options. Some recipes
specify natural or synthetic (or Di or TriCal) and they are usually more
picky about which one to use.
MY rule as a supplier, as I stated before is always to ask the
customer. However, in the event that s/he does not know which one they
want (which happens frequently), I use the following defaults:
Raku Glaze: I always sell DiCalcium Bone Ash (Natural)
Cone 6 and up: Usually Tricalcium Bone Ash (Synthetic)
Sometimes, I advise people to start with DiCal because it's a bit
cheaper (I like to say Start with DiCal and if it doesn't work the way
you want try Tri - he he):
DiCalcium Bone Ash $1.85/#
TriCalcium Bone Ash $2.30/#
Cindy Bracker
Bracker's Good Earth Clays, Inc.
sdr wrote:
> In general,
>if you order Bone Ash from your supplier, they send you
>tricalcium phosphate. I use both interchangeably, no
>problems thus far.
>
>regards
>
>Dannon Rhudy
>
>______________________________________________________________________________
>Send postings to clayart@lsv.ceramics.org
>
>You may look at the archives for the list or change your subscription
>settings from http://www.ceramics.org/clayart/
>
>Moderator of the list is Mel Jacobson who may be reached at melpots@pclink.com.
>
>
>
>
mailtoandrew@FSMAIL.NET on thu 7 oct 04
Hello Cindy,
Of course no comment about your materials which you know well but
DiCalcium phosphate need not necessarily be natural bone: both Tri Ca and
Di Ca can be produced chemically.
Globally bone ash is still widely sold for ceramics, and most bone china
is to still made using it.
Performance of synthetic and natural bone, and even grades of the latter,
is not the same; some applications may find no difference but as
always ... test.
Thats all,
Andrew
Ron Roy on fri 8 oct 04
Hi Cindy and everyone,
I also have seen the tricalcium work differently than bone ash - in a cone
10 reduction iron glaze - the tricalcium did not give the iron red as well
as natural bone ash did.
When you compare the analysis of Boneash and tricalcium phosphate you will
find them very similar - and in most caes it is the right substitution.
RR
>I ALWAYS ask customers to specify which bone ash: DiCalcium Phosphate
>(Natural Bone Ash) or TriCalcium Phosphate (Synthetic Bone Ash). Many
>customers have told us that they do not always work interchangeably.
>They will work similarly and if it's a new recipe, you can basically
>pick one and try it, or preferably, test both options. Some recipes
>specify natural or synthetic (or Di or TriCal) and they are usually more
>picky about which one to use.
>MY rule as a supplier, as I stated before is always to ask the
>customer. However, in the event that s/he does not know which one they
>want (which happens frequently), I use the following defaults:
>Raku Glaze: I always sell DiCalcium Bone Ash (Natural)
>Cone 6 and up: Usually Tricalcium Bone Ash (Synthetic)
>Sometimes, I advise people to start with DiCal because it's a bit
>cheaper (I like to say Start with DiCal and if it doesn't work the way
>you want try Tri - he he):
>DiCalcium Bone Ash $1.85/#
>TriCalcium Bone Ash $2.30/#
>Cindy Bracker
Ron Roy
RR#4
15084 Little Lake Road
Brighton, Ontario
Canada
K0K 1H0
Phone: 613-475-9544
Fax: 613-475-3513
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