tony clennell on sat 5 dec 09
I think where I'm in a fog here on these extruded handles is that
even if the potter pushes ,squeezes, alters the handle they are trying
to make it look like it ain't extruded. Why not celebrate the process
and leave it alone like the wonderful extruded handles on the salt
glazed work of Walter Keeler of Wales. Wally was best known for his
work that referenced tin ware. Pots made from tin. To give that sharp
edge of metal pots the extruded handle is a natural. I like work that
celebrates the process . If it is coil built I like to see little bits
of the join even though the potter smoothed it out partially. I have
some wonderful pots of Judith Graham that celebrate being coil built.
My work at USU showed the handbuilding process complete with the joins
and seams.
I think wonderful pots could (underline could) be made with a
hydraulic press. Multiple pressings, impressing, etc, etc. Trouble is
it is so often used for slam bam thank you mame pots. More is better
kinda approach.
I'm off for a day of retailing but couldn't help but think of how
"celebrating the process" should be a big part of potters mantra.
Cheers,
Tony
--
http://sourcherrypottery.com
http://smokieclennell.blogspot.com
Workshop Feb 5,6,7 Mudbucket Pottery
Myrtle Beach, SC
info@mudbucketpottery.com
David Hendley on sat 5 dec 09
Why? Why not make extruded pots look thrown, extruded
handles look pulled, thrown pots look extruded, thrown
pots look handbuilt, or handbuilt pots look thrown?
As a potter with decades of experience in making and looking,
I love encountering a piece that has me scratching my head
and muttering, "how'd they do that."
Heck, the most over-used contemporary pottery description
and workshop premise is "thrown and altered". Tony, why
do you have to push, squeeze, and alter your pieces from the
wheel?
"Celebrate the process" and leave them round and symmetrical!
Yes, it's all about process, but there are no rules and no need
to categorize everything.
Have a great day of retailing. Wish I could drop in for a spot
of cider.
David Hendley
david@farmpots.com
http://www.farmpots.com
----- Original Message -----
>I think where I'm in a fog here on these extruded handles is that
> even if the potter pushes ,squeezes, alters the handle they are trying
> to make it look like it ain't extruded. Why not celebrate the process
> and leave it alone like the wonderful extruded handles on the salt
> glazed work of Walter Keeler of Wales. Wally was best known for his
> work that referenced tin ware. Pots made from tin. To give that sharp
> edge of metal pots the extruded handle is a natural. I like work that
> celebrates the process . If it is coil built I like to see little bits
> of the join even though the potter smoothed it out partially. I have
> some wonderful pots of Judith Graham that celebrate being coil built.
Jeff Gieringer on sat 5 dec 09
----- Original Message -----
From: "tony clennell"
To:
Sent: Saturday, December 05, 2009 9:21 AM
Subject: Make extrusions look like extrusions
>I think where I'm in a fog here on these extruded handles is that
> even if the potter pushes ,squeezes, alters the handle they are trying
> to make it look like it ain't extruded. Why not celebrate the process
> and leave it alone like the wonderful extruded handles on the salt
> glazed work of Walter Keeler of Wales. Wally was best known for his
> work that referenced tin ware. Pots made from tin. To give that sharp
> edge of metal pots the extruded handle is a natural. I like work that
> celebrates the process . If it is coil built I like to see little bits
> of the join even though the potter smoothed it out partially. I have
> some wonderful pots of Judith Graham that celebrate being coil built.
> My work at USU showed the handbuilding process complete with the joins
> and seams.
> I think wonderful pots could (underline could) be made with a
> hydraulic press. Multiple pressings, impressing, etc, etc. Trouble is
> it is so often used for slam bam thank you mame pots. More is better
> kinda approach.
> I'm off for a day of retailing but couldn't help but think of how
> "celebrating the process" should be a big part of potters mantra.
> Cheers,
> Tony
Tony,
I agree! I just came up from applying handles on 80 mugs for a local coffee
shop. They are extruded handles and are of a design that is exclusive to
this coffee shop as I designed and cut the die myself. I do cut and apply m=
y
extruded handles more like a pulled handle, not to disuise the fact that
they are extruded, but because I like the way it looks. A rubber stamp
extruded handle that is just stuck on a mug usually resembles a big ear
sticking off the side of a head. That, I don't like. But a stylish mug
with a stylish handle, regardless of how it was made is a nice mug, assumin=
g
that there is quality. If there is no quality, it doesn't really matter ho=
w
you made the handle.
Jeff Gieringer
Berea, Kentucky
tony clennell on sun 6 dec 09
David wrote:
On Sat, Dec 5, 2009 at 4:07 PM, David Hendley wrote:
> Why? Why not make extruded pots look thrown, extruded
> handles look pulled, thrown pots look extruded, thrown
> pots look handbuilt, or handbuilt pots look thrown?
> As a potter with decades of experience in making and looking,
> I love encountering a piece that has me scratching my head
> and muttering, "how'd they do that."
>
> Heck, the most over-used contemporary pottery description
> and workshop premise is "thrown and altered". Tony, why
> do you have to push, squeeze, and alter your pieces from the
> wheel?
> "Celebrate the process" and leave them round and symmetrical!
> Yes, it's all about process, but there are no rules and no need
> to categorize everything.
>
> Have a great day of retailing. Wish I could drop in for a spot
> of cider.
David: I too wish you could be here for cider. I'd put ya to work as
the Wal-mart greeter . That Texas drawl would work better than nature
tapes for getting the crowds to buy. Actually there weren't crowds but
sales were up. 4 or 5 heavy hitters saved the day. One bonus was one
of our customers is a Phd in computers and took Sheila's hard drive
home and worked into the wee hours and recovered our mailing list. I
know you even have to back up a Mac."
Now for the post on make extrusions look like extrusions. The cut and
alter people are trying to do exactly what you enjoy "make ya wonder
how they did it." Take something off the wheel and make it look like
it couldn't have been from the wheel. You ought to be the biggest fan
of the process.
You know workshops are about "How do I do that?" My work is not
altered it is "round" and I push that. Round till it almost can't get
any rounder without collapsing. My other claim to fame (at least in my
own mind) is sectional(not sexual) throwing. Putting pieces together
to make a larger version of same.
I don't have any rules per se. I'd press pots if I had the space,
technology,wisdom. and $$$ I'd have a ball fooling with the process to
make interesting work. I've always loved the Koehler toilet factory
residency idea where a potter gets to go work at the factory and mess
with toilets and sinks. that would be cool beyond belief.
I say use any process you can. Just do it well and push it.
Off to clean up the studio from retailing mode to being a mud pit
again. thankfully!
Cheers,
Tony
Lee Love on sun 6 dec 09
On Sun, Dec 6, 2009 at 8:31 AM, tony clennell wro=
=3D
te:
> I don't have any rules per se. I'd press pots if I had the space,
Jiggered plates make a lot of sense to me, with hand finishing of the
foot side. If the foot is made with "extra" that you trim, it is
impossible to tell from hand thrown and trimmed.
--
Lee, a Mashiko potter in Minneapolis
http://mashikopots.blogspot.com/
"Ta tIr na n-=3DF3g ar chul an tI=3D97tIr dlainn trina ch=3DE9ile"=3D97tha=
t is, "T=3D
he
land of eternal youth is behind the house, a beautiful land fluent
within itself." -- John O'Donohue
marci and rex on sun 6 dec 09
At 08:31 AM 12/6/2009, tony clennell wrote:
> I've always loved the Koehler toilet factory
>residency idea where a potter gets to go work at the factory and mess
>with toilets and sinks. that would be cool beyond belief.
If its anything like Wedgewood, it wouldnt be much different
from working at Ford or GM ... You'd have your assembly
line section of the piece and do that one thing over and over..
Marci
Lee Love on sun 6 dec 09
On Sun, Dec 6, 2009 at 11:02 AM, marci and rex wrote=
=3D
:
> At 08:31 AM 12/6/2009, tony clennell wrote:
>>
>> =3DA0I've always loved the Koehler toilet factory
>> residency idea where a potter gets to go work at the factory and mess
>> with toilets and sinks. that would be cool beyond belief.
>
>
> If its =3DA0anything like Wedgewood,
Kholer's residencies allowed artists to work at their facilities
making creative work. No, they don't work on the line.
--=3D20
--
Lee, a Mashiko potter in Minneapolis
http://mashikopots.blogspot.com/
"Ta tIr na n-=3DF3g ar chul an tI=3D97tIr dlainn trina ch=3DE9ile"=3D97tha=
t is, "T=3D
he
land of eternal youth is behind the house, a beautiful land fluent
within itself." -- John O'Donohue
Randall Moody on sun 6 dec 09
Honesty? I was recently in a Cracker Barrel where there appeared to be a
nicely thrown pot. I walked over and upon closer inspection it was slip
cast. I felt lied to.
--Randall in Atlanta--
-----Original Message-----
From: Clayart [mailto:Clayart@LSV.CERAMICS.ORG] On Behalf Of David Hendley
Sent: Saturday, December 05, 2009 4:07 PM
To: Clayart@LSV.CERAMICS.ORG
Subject: Re: Make extrusions look like extrusions
Why? Why not make extruded pots look thrown, extruded
handles look pulled, thrown pots look extruded, thrown
pots look handbuilt, or handbuilt pots look thrown?
Jeff Gieringer on sun 6 dec 09
Randall,
Had you looked a little closer, you would have probably seen "Made in
China". I won't spend my money in Cracker Barrel anymore. There's too many
good mom and pop all American restaurants out there that need our support.
Cracker Barrel falls into the same category as Wally World. I'm also no
longer a WallyWorldWhore.
Jeff Gieringer
Berea, Kentucky
----- Original Message -----
From: "Randall Moody"
To:
Sent: Sunday, December 06, 2009 7:39 PM
Subject: Re: Make extrusions look like extrusions
> Honesty? I was recently in a Cracker Barrel where there appeared to be a
> nicely thrown pot. I walked over and upon closer inspection it was slip
> cast. I felt lied to.
>
>
> --Randall in Atlanta--
>
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Clayart [mailto:Clayart@LSV.CERAMICS.ORG] On Behalf Of David Hendle=
y
> Sent: Saturday, December 05, 2009 4:07 PM
> To: Clayart@LSV.CERAMICS.ORG
> Subject: Re: Make extrusions look like extrusions
>
> Why? Why not make extruded pots look thrown, extruded
> handles look pulled, thrown pots look extruded, thrown
> pots look handbuilt, or handbuilt pots look thrown?
>
KATHI LESUEUR on mon 7 dec 09
I know a couple who used to supply tons of pots to Cracker Barrel.
Then, CB sent samples to China and had them reproduced. They were
slapped with a lawsuit and stopped using the designs. In the contract
with CB the potters had specifically cited ownership of the designs
and that they could not be reproduced by others. CB still didn't buy
from them anymore but they did stop having their work copied. I,
also, won't eat there. Like Walmart, they are responsible for putting
many small manufacturers out of business. Besides, their food has
gotten lousy, their prices have gotten high, and I don't like their
employment policies.
KATHI LESUEUR
http://www.lesueurclaywork.com
On Dec 6, 2009, at 8:35 PM, Jeff Gieringer wrote:
> Randall,
>
> Had you looked a little closer, you would have probably seen "Made in
> China". I won't spend my money in Cracker Barrel anymore. There's
> too many
> good mom and pop all American restaurants out there that need our
> support.
> Cracker Barrel falls into the same category as Wally World. I'm
> also no
> longer a WallyWorldWhore.
>
> Jeff Gieringer
> Berea, Kentucky
>
>
> -----
>
>> Honesty? I was recently in a Cracker Barrel where there appeared
>> to be a
>> nicely thrown pot. I walked over and upon closer inspection it was
>> slip
>> cast. I felt lied to.
>>
>>
>> --Randall in Atlanta--
>>
>>
>>
James Freeman on mon 7 dec 09
On Mon, Dec 7, 2009 at 6:50 AM, KATHI LESUEUR wr=
ote:
> I know a couple who used to supply tons of pots to Cracker Barrel.
>
I, also, won't eat there. Like Walmart, they are responsible for putting
many small manufacturers out of business. Besides, their food has
gotten lousy, their prices have gotten high, and I don't like their
employment policies.
Hi, Kathi, et alii...
It's not the companies like Cracker Barrel or Walmart that have put small
operations out of business. It is our neighbors who have done so because,
for whatever reason, likely a combination of economics and lack of
discernment, they prefer the Chinese crap and the mediocre food offered up
by such establishments.
We had a very lovely restaurant in our town. The investors pumped at least
half a million dollars into the place, beautifully restoring a 100 year old
theatre. Service and food were both great (well, except that they served
polenta, which can in no way be considered human food), but the place was
always empty. They went out of business in less than two years. Down the
road a bit is a Red Lobster. The place is packed every night. Folks go
there for special occasions, and think they're living large.
My own sainted wife, who definitely appreciates the arts, drinks her mornin=
g
coffee from a Chinese mug from the dollar store, and lately from a cheap
logo mug given to us by the symphony while they were buttering us up for a
donation. She bypasses a cupboard full of mugs made by me, our friends, an=
d
several art fair potters.
Symphony orchestras founder and fail, while youngsters who cannot sing, wit=
h
computer generated background "music", make millions.
In our society, consumers make their own choices based on their own unique
factors. Those companies providing the combination of product and price
which the market desires prosper, while those that cannot or do not do so
fail. Harsh perhaps, but entirely natural. For each of us who prefer to
spend a couple of hours enjoying a wonderful meal and good wine, there are =
a
million people who prefer a Big Mac, or a mediocre steak at Appleby's. For
each of us who will spend money on a ticket to the symphony, there are
several million folks who will spend money for a Hannah Montana or Fifty
Cent ticket. For each of us who prefers a $25 handmade mug, there are a
million people who prefer a $4 Chinese mug. Lamentable, perhaps, but just
the way it is. We are (happily) an anachronism.
Take care.
...James
James Freeman
"All I say is by way of discourse, and nothing by way of advice. I should
not speak so boldly if it were my due to be believed."
-Michel de Montaigne
http://www.jamesfreemanstudio.com
http://www.flickr.com/photos/jamesfreemanstudio/
http://www.jamesfreemanstudio.com/clayart/
>
Rimas VisGirda on mon 7 dec 09
Hello Randall,Yesterday you wrote about being cheated at Kracker Barrel. A =
few days ago I posted something that was filled with html and hard to read.=
It said that years ago I threw a cup that I then worked on to make it look=
like a cast cup -that is a thrown cup that is altered to look like a cheap=
casting of a thrown cup... do 2 negatives make a positive, as in math? And=
if so, why don't 2 positives make a negative?-Rimas
Des & Jan Howard on mon 7 dec 09
Tony
Tom Spleth writes about his Kohler Residency.
Sigh, sounds like heaven.
http://spleth.com/tomspleth/retrospective/pastessays/essaykohlerresidency.h=
tml
Des
tony clennell wrote:
> Putting pieces together
> to make a larger version of same.
> I don't have any rules per se. I'd press pots if I had the space,
> technology,wisdom. and $$$ I'd have a ball fooling with the process to
> make interesting work. I've always loved the Koehler toilet factory
> residency idea where a potter gets to go work at the factory and mess
> with toilets and sinks. that would be cool beyond belief.
> I say use any process you can. Just do it well and push it.
--
Des & Jan Howard
Lue Pottery
Lue NSW
Australia
2850
02 6373 6419
www.luepottery.hwy.com.au
-32.656072 149.840624
Dannon Rhudy on mon 7 dec 09
James Freeman said:
> In our society, consumers make their own choices based on their own uniqu=
e
> factors. Those companies providing the combination of product and price
> which the market desires prosper, while those that cannot or do not do so
> fail. Harsh perhaps, but entirely natural. For each of us who prefer to
> spend a couple of hours enjoying a wonderful meal and good wine, there ar=
e
a
> million people who prefer a Big Mac, or a mediocre steak at Appleby's.
For
> each of us who will spend money on a ticket to the symphony, there are
> several million folks who will spend money for a Hannah Montana or Fifty
> Cent ticket. For each of us who prefers a $25 handmade mug, there are a
> million people who prefer a $4 Chinese mug. Lamentable, perhaps, but jus=
t
> the way it is. We are (happily) an anachronism.>>>>>>>>
It is harsh, and it is true. People spend their money where THEY
want to spend it. So far, they are still entitled to do so - if they have
any
disposable income left. And, much as I would like them to prefer
to spend it buying MY stuff, I can't -thank god -
FORCE them to do so. I might, and do,
entice such ones as I can to buy from me
rather than Walmart. Some are happy to, most prefer a $2 mug to
mine, as James said. It fits their budget, or their esthetic, or whatever.
Their money, their choice. My life, my choice - I like making things.
Carry on.
regards
Dannon Rhudy
Luke Nealey on mon 7 dec 09
On 12/7/09, Dannon Rhudy wrote:
>
> Their money, their choice. My life, my choice - I like making things.
> Carry on.
>
> regards
>
> Dannon Rhudy
>
Dannon,
Amen. This message needs to preserved and sent every time the list veers
into the "its unfair/immoral/not right/under appreciated/under
compensated/selling out" ditch. It's the world, choose your path, fight
some battles, and as you said "carry on."
Regards,
Luke Nealey
Rankin Co. MS
Jeff Gieringer on mon 7 dec 09
James Freeman said:
"In our society, consumers make their own choices based on their own unique
factors. Those companies providing the combination of product and price
which the market desires prosper, while those that cannot or do not do so
fail. Harsh perhaps, but entirely natural. For each of us who prefer to
spend a couple of hours enjoying a wonderful meal and good wine, there are =
a
million people who prefer a Big Mac, or a mediocre steak at Appleby's. For
each of us who will spend money on a ticket to the symphony, there are
several million folks who will spend money for a Hannah Montana or Fifty
Cent ticket. For each of us who prefers a $25 handmade mug, there are a
million people who prefer a $4 Chinese mug. Lamentable, perhaps, but just
the way it is. We are (happily) an anachronism."
Very sad, but very very true. It's tough to teach culture to those who don'=
t
want it.
Jeff Gieringer
Berea, Kentucky
----- Original Message -----
From: "James Freeman"
To:
Sent: Monday, December 07, 2009 11:34 AM
Subject: Re: Make extrusions look like extrusions
> On Mon, Dec 7, 2009 at 6:50 AM, KATHI LESUEUR
> wrote:
>
>> I know a couple who used to supply tons of pots to Cracker Barrel.
>>
>
> I, also, won't eat there. Like Walmart, they are responsible for putting
> many small manufacturers out of business. Besides, their food has
> gotten lousy, their prices have gotten high, and I don't like their
> employment policies.
>
>
>
> Hi, Kathi, et alii...
>
> It's not the companies like Cracker Barrel or Walmart that have put small
> operations out of business. It is our neighbors who have done so because=
,
> for whatever reason, likely a combination of economics and lack of
> discernment, they prefer the Chinese crap and the mediocre food offered u=
p
> by such establishments.
>
> We had a very lovely restaurant in our town. The investors pumped at
> least
> half a million dollars into the place, beautifully restoring a 100 year
> old
> theatre. Service and food were both great (well, except that they served
> polenta, which can in no way be considered human food), but the place was
> always empty. They went out of business in less than two years. Down th=
e
> road a bit is a Red Lobster. The place is packed every night. Folks go
> there for special occasions, and think they're living large.
>
> My own sainted wife, who definitely appreciates the arts, drinks her
> morning
> coffee from a Chinese mug from the dollar store, and lately from a cheap
> logo mug given to us by the symphony while they were buttering us up for =
a
> donation. She bypasses a cupboard full of mugs made by me, our friends,
> and
> several art fair potters.
>
> Symphony orchestras founder and fail, while youngsters who cannot sing,
> with
> computer generated background "music", make millions.
>
> In our society, consumers make their own choices based on their own uniqu=
e
> factors. Those companies providing the combination of product and price
> which the market desires prosper, while those that cannot or do not do so
> fail. Harsh perhaps, but entirely natural. For each of us who prefer to
> spend a couple of hours enjoying a wonderful meal and good wine, there ar=
e
> a
> million people who prefer a Big Mac, or a mediocre steak at Appleby's.
> For
> each of us who will spend money on a ticket to the symphony, there are
> several million folks who will spend money for a Hannah Montana or Fifty
> Cent ticket. For each of us who prefers a $25 handmade mug, there are a
> million people who prefer a $4 Chinese mug. Lamentable, perhaps, but jus=
t
> the way it is. We are (happily) an anachronism.
>
> Take care.
>
> ...James
>
> James Freeman
>
> "All I say is by way of discourse, and nothing by way of advice. I shoul=
d
> not speak so boldly if it were my due to be believed."
> -Michel de Montaigne
>
> http://www.jamesfreemanstudio.com
> http://www.flickr.com/photos/jamesfreemanstudio/
> http://www.jamesfreemanstudio.com/clayart/
>
>
>>
>
Snail Scott on mon 7 dec 09
> At 08:31 AM 12/6/2009, tony clennell wrote:
>> I've always loved the Koehler toilet factory
>> residency idea where a potter gets to go work at the factory and mess
>> with toilets and sinks. that would be cool beyond belie
On Dec 6, 2009, at 11:02 AM, marci and rex wrote:
> If its anything like Wedgewood, it wouldnt be much different
> from working at Ford or GM ... You'd have your assembly
> line section of the piece and do that one thing over and over.
No, no, it's an artist's residency AT the Kohler
factory, not a factory job! You get access to their
industrial-scale slip-casting and iron-casting and
enameling equipment and to their staff's expertise,
(and the right to use their raw materials as well as
factory seconds) but you do your own work as you
see fit. It is a long-time dream of mine! (So why
am I making it sound so sweet? Am I nuts? don't
need more competition for it!. So, forget what I just
wrote - it sucks, you'll hate it, stay home! ;)
-Snail
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